A little tune bout spuds

Hmmm,

Ok Ponder - spill the beans - why did you write the above? Was it...

1) I need the points, points!! points!!!!!
2) I've been drinking (Hey I finally found a use for the barfing smilie)
3) I was bored and/or affected by mind altering drugs.

Ponder - I'm not having a go, but your above post got me thinking - which probably wasn't the point of it

*If* it was (1) I think we have discovered a flaw in Lee and Dewi's excellent points based system.

Questions for Lee and Dewi...

Does Ponder ~LOSE~ points if we declare his post as ~SPAM~?

How many nursery rhymes/jokes/erotic limericks must he write in individual threads before he gets an "offical" reprimand?

If I wish to save up my points and buy a better block of land in Anhk, can I post my Joke file on the forum in individual threads? (There has to be at least 300+ jokes in there. Do you think I can buy the palace for that?)

@Ponder - I'm not having a go at you mate, I personally love your idio-syn-crazies, always give me a laugh at work. Have fun.

Windle

indeed 1 2 and 3. although not 3. or 1.

it was just a random thought at the time.

*!!!crap excuse alert!!!*

i sort of thought i would set up as topic where people can just let out their pure randomness. and i set it off quite well me thinks.

Sorry WP i will not do it again... *sits in corner weeping*

and @ Mr Nice Admins: please no! nooo! noooo! noooo--aaarrrghhhhh!

must. keep. points. must. keep. points.

Now Now Ponder it's all OK. Don't cry... because if you start cry crying..then...then I'll start. (wow you can just feel the sincerity there eh?)

As I said Ponder I ~wasn't~ having a go, and you being a moderator and all, it seemed...fairer to ask the question with one of your posts, rather than one of some newbie's.

I just want to know if Lee and Dewi have a strategy in place to stop potential spamming on the forum in an effort to raise points. (I'm sure that they do)

I'm just a nosy b.....d who wants to know these things.

Windle

thats right! ill mod you untill it hurts! you hear me?!

mur har har har har har har har!!!!!!!

ahem. im done.

I think nosy is a good thing. Interesting thing is that it's most of us 'old-bies' who are nosing the most -- testing the waters, pushing the buttons to see what's happening, etc.

I also thought that in reference to the 'Referral' plan (discovered by me, about to be promoted by Lee) that it, too, leaves itself open for abuses. When Lee says,

it seems to me that they'd better have some way of knowing that it's not just me clicking my own referral link for the free points! And no, I am seriously planning real referrals...

I like the idea of losing points for spam, though. Could it be possible to strip away *two* points per spam message, one to undo the point given for new content, and another, punitive point? Just thoughts...

who would have thought that such a random post would have sparked such a deep discussion!

jolly jolly good!

Hmm Take away 2 points when Ponder spams the forum.. Still can't find that drooling smilie

In all seriousness however Dearmer, how would you want this done? At present ~Everyone~ has the ability to report something as spam. Do you want the "point removal" ability restricted to those moderators with pointy sticks? A Three strikes policy? A Reflection of the posting rate? - As in (Ponder posts something very random, but he does post a lot for forum games, and other stuff, so as a percentage its not large." Is Spam Reporting something that needs to be earned by community members?

Just some thought provoking questions.

Windle

I think that point removal should definitely be in the hands of the druids. I might say more if I could remember exactly what happens when someone reports something as spam. If, for instance, Ponder decides to nurse a grudge against me (or anyone else does against any other one else), a wholesale spam-reporting campaign shouldn't be that easily effective. In other words, it shouldn't be that easy for anyone to strip away a rival's points by indiscriminately reporting everything they say as spam. It might have to be by consensus of the mods that the two-point rule should come into effect.

As to the percentage question, I'm not sure that's the best idea. If (to continue using your Ponder hypothetical situation) Ponder is in every other respect a fine, upstanding citizen, doing good works and organizing after school activities for the kiddies to get them off the mean streets, does that mean he's entitled to a little bit of shoplifting from time to time with no penalty?

Perhaps an even better refinement might work like this: You get points for posting new content, *lose* points if it's blatantly an attempt to post drivel for the sake of the point reward, *AND* if you post thought-provoking, comment-raising content that actually stirs up a real discussion, you get extra points (after a certain amount of comments on your original post). That would further underscore the rewards for posting (i.e., the point is to get people talking, not just to post about potatoes...)

Or of course, the other option is just to reward everybody with a point for every 100 characters posted! Whatever works...

As an aside, I've long maintained that cars should be equipped with 'laser tag' systems. If someone is driving recklessly (or recklessly slow), other motorists should be able to register complaints by zapping them with the gun in their own vehicle (I mean, who *wouldn't* want to shoot the seniors crawling along in the passing lane?!) After so many flags against your driving record, you would have to either report for a new driving test, or your car would just *stop working*. ...And I guess there *is* a reason why I'm not running the world.

"Lee and Dewi needed to comment"

We couldn't possibly

now why would i do that? :D

but on a more serious note: i do think points can and should only be taken away by Site Druids (we deserve the capital letters ) namely because The local admins have entrusted us with Moderating powers so why not use them? i also agree with the three strikes and you're out idea as some people may not realise what they are typing colud be offensive to others and/or spam (in this case we would give them a tap on the shoulder (no pointy sticks this time - unless it serious of course) and say don't so it again, if they keep offending points should be taken. again if it a serious offence then instant banning is generally the way forward (any one for a nice russian lady perhaps!?)

but saying all these negative things makes Mr Ponder sad, so i will finish on a high: the point system (so far) appears to be working a treat. BUT!

yes alas a but. i referred someone to this site and they signed up (because i have just got them into diiscworld ) and i only got one point! i though we were supposed to get like 5 or something. give me money!!!! in a nice un marked £10 bills. please. thankyou

so not such a happy ending

Ok then more thought provoking questions:-

1) I like Dearmers idea that each thudder get points based on amount they write. To use magrat as an example - she posts a great deal more than I do, but doesn't create many more threads, so we get similar points - doesn't seem fair

2) Reporting - for example, OB, Ponder and Windle decide that the thread post "A little Tune about Spuds" has crossed the line and is a blatant attempt at points garnering. But they haven't discussed it and each takes two points off !!! What reporting should there be? Edit in the post to say points should be taken?

3) Certain things should not be subject to a 3 strikes rule, EG sufficiently bad language, sufficently bad sledging....what else?

Squishy Brain - that'll do

Windle

Any big sort of moderating tends to be discussed first - mainly so other Druids don't get confused as well as the standard user.

we of course delete spam without discussion - well because there is no need to

Remeber folks - The Team of Friendly Druids and Admins is only a PM away so if you are having issues contact one of us and we can see what we can do. as you are well aware we have pointy sticks.

i think that points per how much you post is a brill idea! why did i not think of it?! it seems to make more sense as 95% of all posts are replys to topics and not creating new ones.
i also think that the person who has created a new topic should get rewarded by how many people reply:
Create topic: 1
10 replies: +1
20 replies: +2

although then there is the issue of forum games and wether they should count in the point scheme, as technically they aren't really topics of discussion. I think mazur posted somewhere that you should get rewarded more for beating better players, so perhaps the point scheme could be incorporated into that? like 1 point lose, 2 point draw, 3 point victory, 4 point winning considerably or beating alot higher skill level.

just some thoughts for you to discet and analyse.

ME TOO!

Should I get points for that?

That's very kind, Windle. But again, I point out that I win the posting race effortlessly by playing nearly all my games on the forum. That's because when I go to the client, there is pretty much no one there. Unless I make a point to visit whilst I am supposed to be making dinner, in which case domestic difficulties ensue. Or if Dearmer and I have a date, which we have done once or twice.

Consequently, I may post five or six times a day, but the vast majority to forum Thud. Of course, I would love to get points for all that. No denying, though, that Forum Thud is different from the others. I have no strong opinions on the "how to get points" question, though. The folks with pointy sticks can work that out, as far as I'm concerned.

We might want to watch that kind of talk, lest we should incur the wrath of Verence and Mrs. Dearmer, but perhaps we should meet up again some time. (Maybe once Lee and Dewi figure out how to award points for live gameplay.)

Another thought that comes to mind around the points system is that perhaps points should be awarded for posting *popular* content.

@ Dearmer
Yes you should get points for that....unless you do it too much then the wrath of the pointy sticks mean we say you are spam...and maybe take points off Use your judgement, how frequently do ~you~ think Ponder will let you get away with it?

@Ponder
I think the whole area of determining who is "skilled" and who is "Not skilled" is fraught with difficulty. I would consider myself "not skilled" but others may disagree.

@Ponder again
Popularity of discussion? But how would you measure this? Number of views? amount of responses?

@Lee - Cop out artist

@ Magrat - You're welcome

Windle

no

Should *you* get points for *that*?

huzzah to all and be merry!

One thing I'd like to warn against is making the points system too complicated. As they effectively become the game's currency, people will take the gaining of them quite seriously, and expect to understand how it works. In order to prevent people from feeling cheated (if for example they dont fully understand the system so dont get the points they expect) we shouldn't make things too hard to follow, I would say.

Mr Scrub

Scrub

Well, we are not changing things here, just speculating. It's Huey, Dewi and Lee, who have the final say, and no doubt there will be a poll when we are finished with the "where should the first thudgame settlements be?" question. But I agree, there needs to be a simple set of rules that everyone can follow (and hopefully not abuse too badly).

Anyone else care to make a comment on how whether we need changes to the existing points system?

Windle

Bueller? Anyone? Comments?

Windle

Heh, LOL!! caught me out, you did!

Seriously, this thread has been developing nicely and we're paying close attention to it. As we've said before we don;t want to jump into most dicsussions and post something that's taken as gospel (unless the thread seems to be fading) for a coupla reasons:

1. we may miss something genius that someone won't post because Lee and/or Dewi has "laid down the law". Don't ever let us stop you posting something (unless we say "Stop!" like that with at least one capital letter and an exclamation mark, and we'll almost only say that in response to many, many complaints).

2. we may say something definitive and then change our minds shortly afterwards and have to backtrack. For example, someone mentioned he cities poll. There has been a major change in what we proposed and mooted before. We'll still do "cities" but we've found that we can't use Ankh Morpork or any other named Discworld city as there's something else in store for them. More info only when, like Grolsch, it's ready.

So do carry on; I'll be back later to comment on a coupla other things after going to the gym then writing a suitably welcoming "Welcome e-mail" for new signer-uppers as suggested by Ponder

TTFN!

excellent! see! im useful for something. but what i actually suggested was a welcome forum, like just above or below anoncements so people can keep coming back to it for future reference.

it could also have linkies to PM 'mins and 'ods.

plus a link that blows up their computer. then we could laugh. and then cry because we have to pay for it.