Dear friends: got the game for Christmas, so we're not too deep into it yet. But like others on this forum, we wondered if one dwarf could capture one troll. I reviewed the rules (same as the ones posted here) very carefully, and concluded that one dwarf cannot capture a troll.
There is only one reference to how dwarfs capture in the rules, and here it is:
"A DWARF captures by having a straight, unbroken, line of dwarfs aimed at a troll and hurling the front dwarf straight ahead to hit the troll."
We notice that the number of dwarfs in the line is plural. There is no mention of a dwarf capturing without plural dwarfs being involved.
It would, of course, change the whole balance of power if this were different.
So what do you all think? Am I wrong? If so, where do you see that in the rules? Because I'm confused.
Thanks.
Re: I don't think one dwarf can capture a troll.
It's explicitly stated in the rulebook I received with my Thud board that a single dwarf can capture a troll.
A single dwarf can attack a troll right next to it, as there are 0 squares between the two.
Does your copy say something different?
Re: I don't think one dwarf can capture a troll.
It's explicitly stated in the rulebook I received with my Thud board that a single dwarf can capture a troll.
A single dwarf can attack a troll right next to it, as there are 0 squares between the two.
Does your copy say something different?
I see my problem now. Thanks for the help. The sentence you quote is from one of the examples. It isn't included in the section on capturing, and I must not have absorbed the examples fully. For that matter, the sentence you pointed me to doesn't appear in the rules posted here:
http://game.thudguild.com/rules.html
After I got here looking for help, I kept referring back to the copy posted here, which omits the examples, and got even more confused.
OK. Now we're ready to play real Thud. That's good, because it's boring here in the Lancre palace.
Thanks.
Re: I don't think one dwarf can capture a troll.
The sentence you quote is from one of the examples.
Well, sure. It's just pointing out that lone dwarves aren't a special case; they follow the same rules as everybody else.
Re: I don't think one dwarf can capture a troll.
For that matter, the sentence you pointed me to doesn't appear in the rules posted here:
http://game.thudguild.com/rules.html
Hmmm, will investigate and remedy ASAP. Thanks for pointing that out!
EDIT: OK, that's been sorted! Have a look at: http://game.thudguild.com/rules2.html
Thanks for the "heads-up" on that!
one dwarfe capturing troll
... yes but after the dwarf has moved next to the troll, the troll just moves one place further away, and, then on the dwarves go, he's not next to the troll anymore, so has to move, not captue, and cetra....
.. surely?
thats what i was thinking. if the troll is already next to the dwarf, surely the dwarf would hve been smashed to smithereens already. unless somebody is clever and has managed to get 2 dwarfs near 2 trolls somehow, then one of the trolls is doomed. other than that i doubt a single dwarf will ever take a troll.
+++divide by cucumber error+++please reinstall universe and reboot+++
thats what i was thinking. if the troll is already next to the dwarf, surely the dwarf would hve been smashed to smithereens already. unless somebody is clever and has managed to get 2 dwarfs near 2 trolls somehow, then one of the trolls is doomed. other than that i doubt a single dwarf will ever take a troll.
The explaination as i recall from trevor is that a dwarf ducks under a trolls arms when it moves next to a troll and the troll has to move to another square to swing its club against that dwarf. There are positions especialy if another troll is threatened where it is worth sacrificeing the troll that has had the dwarf moved next to it if saving the other troll gets a better position/more retribution ie able to take more dwarfs.
Also in live game somtimes people dont see a sacrifical dwarf moved next to troll to gain another move so get to take troll but have lost the position that they wanted to save. Worthwhile doing refresh in live game if you cannot see last move done.
thats what i was thinking. if the troll is already next to the dwarf, surely the dwarf would hve been smashed to smithereens already. unless somebody is clever and has managed to get 2 dwarfs near 2 trolls somehow, then one of the trolls is doomed. other than that i doubt a single dwarf will ever take a troll.
Sometimes it's worth it to allow the troll to be taken. You get 2 free moves that way, which should be enough to prevent dwarvish development on two sides.
Single Dwarf Capture of Troll
It also applies later in the game, when you have a pack of Dwarfs hunting the remaining Trolls. I've played several games where I have the remaining Trolls trapped in a straight line behind the Thudstone, with lines of Dwarfs either side threatenening all the reachable squares for the Trolls. At that point, the aim is to force the capture/loss of a Troll by moving a Dwarf directly next to a Troll in the line, because either it doesn't move and you capture it next go, or it moves to capture the Dwarf, the square it must move to is threatened, and you will capture it next go.
The Strategy Tip from this example is 'Don't line all your remaining Trolls up behind the Thudstone - they can get trapped and slaughtered!'
You too? I had my opponents do that a few times at the convention before I learned to warn neophytes against it in my introductory how-to speech
Once you have them pinned down like that it rapidly becomes a bloodbath. Well... gravelpit.
Re: one dwarfe capturing troll
... yes but after the dwarf has moved next to the troll, the troll just moves one place further away, and, then on the dwarves go, he's not next to the troll anymore, so has to move, not captue, and cetra....
.. surely?
True, but that can be very useful! I'm very new to the game (1.5 completed games so far!), but have found it's posible to break up trolls' shoving lines by planting a dwarf on one side of the line. This forces a troll to move out of line in order to defend itself by capturing the dwarf. Breaking up the line for a turn or two allows you to attack the line itself or get a couple of threatened dwarves to safety.
The joy of having so many pieces is that some can be treated as expendable and used to shepherd trolls around the board.
Apologies for typos, spelling and grammar but never content.
Dewi said
"You too? I had my opponents do that a few times at the convention before I learned to warn neophytes against it in my introductory how-to speech
Once you have them pinned down like that it rapidly becomes a bloodbath. Well... gravelpit."
Er, I may have been unclear on which side I was playing at the time in my post. It was mostly my Dwarfs reducing Trolls to rubble in that example. I'm uncertain whether you were commenting from a Dwarf or Troll point of view in your response.
The Strategy Tip still stands though.
I was playing dwarfs: If I were trolls, I'd have to be rarther mean to warn neophytes against beating me
The first time, I felt it was a fluke, but the second time, I realised how they were thinking.
It seems like a relatively good and cunning tactic to them at the outset: the dwarfs' block is all the way over there, and "surely" moving to the other side of the board would cause the dwarfs to have to move the block.
And behind the rock has gotta be the safest place on the board, right?
And then they're pinned into that row, and you get a dwarf at the end of their row, and they're doomed.